When I get back to my personal computer, I’m going to finally move to Linux. I’m a developer primarily on Microsoft technologies, but I’m willing to see if there is a way for me to work on Linux and branch out to other tech.
Vscode and dotnet core (5+) work well on linux
You can also run SQL Server via docker
Do you even need docker for MS-SQL?
I run Arch, so docker was the easiest method of installation.
Rather than try and figure out how to install a .deb manually (and lose package manager perks)
No, it’s not. And I say that as an almost-exclusively Linux users since at least 20 years.
What do you mean? My computer has never had Windows installed on it, so the end of Windows 10 support doesn’t affect me at all. I’m not sure what could be more simple than that.
Linux and Windows are different beasts entirely. Linux is perfect for some but needlessly complex and hard to support for others.
Most people normal people now days need a web browser and LibreOffice (or google docs variant). Pair that with Bazzite or other “ready to go” OS that comes pre installed with multimedia codecs, navidia drivers, a mobile like app store, a mobile like DE and it can be that simple.
Yeah it really isn’t that simple as Windows is deeply entrenched into society. If someone is looking to try Linux it is fairly simple to get into but saying it is somewhat a drop in replacement is not quite true.
Laughs in rolling release
laughs in kernel panics
I’m running nixos unstable. I did get some panics while hibernating with one kernel version, but otherwise it’s been super stable.
Enabling threadedirqs (real-time feature) on the kernel command line does make the kernel panic on boot though.
So glad I came back to Linux a couple years ago. I only use my windows partition to play a game that won’t work as well in Linux, and that list is pretty small for the games I play. Even BG3 worked great in Mint, using a 6 year old build.
the penguin migration was going just fine, until nvidia 570.124.04 dropped, which is when the misery started. :|
Got to check if I can roll back to earlier version.
This is the main barrier for me (other one is migrating a janky access database). I really don’t want to spend my 2 hours free time an evening troubleshooting Nvidia driver issues (4800S series).
Anyone with this card have an experience to share?
I’m currently on that version. May I ask what happened or what should I expect?
rtx3090, 5800x3d, wayland, sddm, kde:
- whole system freezes on boot (with somewhat garbled display) when display manager starts (sddm) - IF >1 displays are plugged in/powered on.
- no issues if sddm starts with one display, and THEN powering up second. - But this has to be done while in sddm, before logging in.
- whole system can (with high chance) freeze again on desktop if at any point a screens are connected/disconnected
- krunner works exactly once, after that it logs errors in journal that some display reference is wrong (the exact wording escapes me atm)
all these things were fine with 570.86.something - the previous version, which apparently was beta.
I see. Then it’s possible that it doesn’t affect older cards. I have GTX 1660Ti and haven’t seen a problem, yet. However I do remember I had to downgrade Nvidia (on tty) a couple years back because it borked my system completely.
Entirely possible, dunno. And not like a 3090 is that new anymore either.
Basically all of the issues mentioned above have been mentioned in various threads over at nvidia’s forums, etc. So they’re not unknown, but kinda wild a released driver has all of these issues whereas the previous beta was seemingly unaffected - feels like someone was bit too triggerhappy to release an untested version to production.
It’d be nice if I could just drop the nvidia card and swap to amdgpu but… that’d require “a bit” of money so I could maintain same (or better) level of performance - and atm I just don’t want to spend that kind of money. :/
Yeah, it’s possible. This is not the first time they did this, probably won’t be the last. Though they solve the issues relatively faster comparing to years ago. That’s something.
It’d be nice if I could just drop the nvidia card and swap to amdgpu but… that’d require “a bit” of money
I’m in the same boat but I’ll most likely use this card until it’s dead or really old. I cannot imagine how the people think about that email they got from Microsoft.
Linux is super reliable, and unless you use cutting edge distro, it’s pretty rare than anything breaks. Even Fedora is pretty stable from experience
The only true problems I ever had (and still has), were with Nvidia. And switching distros ain’t saving you. Linux mint? Breaks on suspend. Nobara? Memory leak. Trying newer versions to see if it fixes it? Where’s my bootloader…
I do understand that laptop RTX 3070 are not common, but still. I just want it to work, and have cuda on it. Is that too much to ask?
Linux is super reliable
It depends on what you want to do with it, which version of which component you run and a couple of other things. In my own experience, if you want a “super reliable” system, get OpenBSD. Linux has a severe lack of QA, mainly because of its decoupled nature.
Nobara memory leak? I’ve been using Nobara for a year and a half and have never heard of this.
It also happens on fedora but to a lesser extent (somehow). It’s all hidden under the Wayland session process
It’s always when I’m using my dedicated GPU, so I guess it’s the driver being fucky.
I have an oddball graphic card so might happen only on it
unless you use cutting edge distro
yea well, “arch btw”. Haven’t had issues really, been running it for years on other systems but my gaming pc with nvidia is the only one with issues… because of course it does. :D
Of course. Mileage may vary. On some systems it may always work, on others it’s “what’s broken this week”.
word. some devices just have angry machine spirits which just can’t be pleased.
Have you tried feeding them your youngest children?
haven’t forked, no children. will neighbour’s do?
Good idea. Try and report back. If it does not work, sorry!
Never had an issue with Nvidia. But then I’m using an Ubuntu distro because I just want my computer to work and I don’t care about bleeding edge / rolling distros.
And I will move to Wayland in a few years when all the issues are sorted out, which I suspect is part of people’s problems.
Rolling releases go brrrrrr.
CentOS is sadly dead anyways.
So it’s a semi-rolling release then.
Yeah, but the system requirements for Windows 11 are a good way above those for 10. Many people would need new machines; whereas Linux still runs decently on hardware from 2003.
At work we run some software that while you can get it to run under Linux it’s not worth the effort even for me to bother.
One supplier is slowly moving towards the runtime being available on BSD at least. They also somewhat decoupled from visual studio in the latest release, while still being mandatory still it’s a step in the right direction.
This always falls on its face for work. No one does collaboration as easy as Microsoft and that’s not changing anytime soon. I mean, everyone would have to move all at once. I can move to Linux on my personal devices and it’s not going to change stats one bit.
Not sure what you mean by “collaboration”. If your are talking about working on documents, spreadsheets, calendar, slides, with your coworkers, sharing, manage access, etc. Google does that pretty well. My company uses everything Google for many years and it’s very good from this perspective. It works absolutely the same from any operating system, Google Chrome is the OS at this point. I am not saying that Google is better than Microsoft as a corporation, just saying that Microsoft has legitimate competitors on the office collaboration market.
No one does collaboration as easy as Microsoft and that’s not changing anytime soon.
Anything in M365 works reasonably well in Linux, even when accessed via Firefox. I do it all the time.
And you can just install Edge if you really want to. It’s on flathub
Yeah I know. I’ve done that as well. I just wanted to point out that it can be done in FF.
No one does collaboration as easy as Microsoft
Try Apple.
Collaboration as in what? Programmers use version control or use an IDE with collaborative coding tools like Jetbrains. That stuff is OS agnostic. If you mean office work Google and Infomaniak provide similar tools as Office365.
Most offices really don’t need Microsoft. They just are stuck in their habits. And MS has a better sales team.
Games and especially modding. I’m holding on to 10 until I can’t. Then i’ll figure out Linux.
Coming from windows 10, last year I tested installing linux mint which is one of the most accessible distros. I found that around a third of the stuff I had running perfectly under Win10 didn’t work. I didn’t find alternatives that were good enough either…
So I said fuck it and did a clean windows 11 install, It’s been a month now and I can really say that it’s way easier to upgrade to windows 11 and turn off all the shit, than to deal with all the stuff that won’t run under linux.
Hopefully this changes in a few more years…
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people have claimed over the years this happens, but I’ve never had this happen with windows 10
I jumped ship from windows 10 to Linux on August and it’s been smooth I have found alternatives for everything, but to be fair I used a lot of foss already on Windows 10.
Started with Debian but although I love it for my homelab I didn’t like it being behind on KDE release so I switched to endeavourOS and I just love it.
there are no settings for all the shit, just some of it, that Microsoft is permitting to switch off. you therefore just have a half-still-shit-on system. that’s totally fine, i don’t expect anyone to invest time into anything. we ain’t got much to start with. but no one using windows is really in control
Honestly Windows 11 isn’t terrible. It is mostly the same as Windows 10 except more demanding for seemingly no reason.
I’ve tried it a couple times and I hate it. The UI sucks, I can’t find shit, and they’ve stripped back control panel even further. Tried to help my mother with virtual disc’s and you can’t simply mount them anymore, instead there was some strange 3rd-party tool I’d never heard of and it didn’t even export files that were too deep in the folder tree. Fucking useless.
All the bloatware sucks, search defaulting to AI and Bing instead of your own computer sucks. Removing administrative controls sucks.
But I’m a visual designer and the market needs powerful industry-ready software like Adobe and Affinity. I can’t design publishing in fucking GIMP. The Linux alternatives aren’t enough. I’m considering using a Linux home machine with Mac for work but the apps I own already are Microsoft so it would be very expensive to switch. So I’ll probably end up using W11 and just complain the whole time.
tip: Windows 10 21h2 IoT Enterprise LTSC is supported until 2032
The simple fact is there will always be that one little thing that stops windows users fron switching. If 99.999999% of all windows software worked on Linux windows users would say “well ill switch when that extra 0.000001% works”. The fact is when Windows users come to Linux they dont want Linux, they want Windows but not made by Microsoft and the fact is Linux is not that. I would take that one step forward and say that when Windows 10 goes EOL half of people wont care and the other half will get new computers, the amount of people who switch to Linux will be statistically insignificant.
Sad but true. I switched to Linux mint for private use.
“well ill switch when that extra 0.000001% works”.
I am well past the point in my personal life where if it doesn’t work on Linux, or in many cases isn’t FOSS itself, it just doesn’t exist to me. I can be motivated to learn new programs when it feels like there’s a good purpose behind it.
I’m in my 40s so maybe it’s combination of “I’m too old for Windows’ shit” and “I’m not too old to learn a few new tricks.”
The fact is when Windows users come to Linux they dont want Linux, they want Windows but not made by Microsoft and the fact is Linux is not that.
Linux Mint Cinnamon may not be that, but it is very close.
My parents mentioned the windows end of life message to me a few weeks ago, and I think I’m going to try mint for them. As far as I know they basically need a file explorer to copy photos from SD cards, and of course a web browser.
Sadly the vast majority of people (even most Linux users) dont understand the benefits of FOSS. Thats why I love organizations like the FSF, EFF, and OSI. However, the sad truth is most people simply do not care.
Statistically insignificant is one way to put it, but I would argue it is somewhat significant. Just perhaps not to the extent we’d like to see. What I’ll be watching for is the major uptick in viruses, malware and ransomware infecting that one half of users that will stay on win10 without a care in the world.
Honestly I don’t really see why some Linux users are pushing so hard for everyone to move to Linux. Use whatever floats your boat.
Personally I think the opposite is better, we need more people telling Windows users “hey if you’re going to Linux expecting Windows just use Windows”. The simple fact is Linux is not a Windows replacement because Linux is fundamentally not Windows. For Linux users like me thats absolutely incredible (we dont want Windows but OSS), but for people who love Windows less so. Linux desktops look different (especially Gnome), Linux software works differently, the terminal is completely different on Linux (its not needed to use Linux but its so powerful that learning it is reccomend), there are installation files (DEB and RPM) but on Linux most people use software repos, and fundamentally the mindset behind Linux is vastly different from Windows.
Downloading a package is not a “installation file.”
Other than that you are spot on
I tried to use language a Windows user might understand, obviously not since nobody packages installers for Linux like Windows (because installers suck)
It is very dangerous downloading and installing random packages. It introduces instability since the package manager maintains the entire system and untested packages can create all sorts of issues.
Best to use native packages that have been tested upstream. If that isn’t possible you want to use some sort of sandbox that can be easily blown away and created. (A container)
I get where you are coming from but it is best to encourage good practices.
Ok I could only install native packages from the offical repo or I can install tons of packages from the AUR :3
(I use Arch btw)
I have a bad professional habit of treating windows machines like Linux, abusing PS Sessions like its SSH, downloading everything via winget, and generally trying to do as much of my admin work without popping open RDP as I can. Sometimes that works super well, and sometimes it throws me for a loop. But most importantly, it opens certain doors that remain shut for folks who insist on always RDPing in and using the GUI
One of us, one of us! Hahaha. I think at the core of it we care about other people and don’t want to see them be stuck in a privacy nightmare with no way to escape… and they paid for that experience. But yes, I also support people doing what they like, I sincerely mean that.
Working in IT also changes your perspective as well. It all boils down to ain’t nobody got time for that
I think there will be a big jump in Europeans switching to Linux because of America going to hell at least.
I was in a meeting today with a few people where we were discussing what direction we want a part of a European government to go in for tech. Getting rid of USA companies and on-boarding open-source solutions. The main issue, as usual, are the users. They’re so used to the M365 suite they won’t accept anything else.
Apart from the fact that most open-source solutions don’t cover the stack Microsoft delivers, IaaS, PaaS, and SaaS.
We need more guidance from the EU to start producing viable alternatives.
Ubuntu supports AD authentication out of the box, so for users whose duties primarily occur in a web browser that rapidly becomes a vary viable option
The whole stack is the issue. E-mail, VM’s, office 365, cloud management, powerBI, copilot, it’s one beautiful ecosystem. There is simply no viable alternative at the moment. It will need to be created.
Of course one can always replace office 365 with libreoffice, but after that it gets more difficult.
I certainly agree, but you can’t replace your entire software, server and groupware stack in a day. Start by transitioning the easiest stuff off of Microsoft, tie it into your existing stack then slowly transition away. Shutting off the last domain controller is a lot easier when you only have a handful of Windows workstations that rely on it than when you have 5000 of them
Lots of comments about gaming from people assuming that companies will continue supporting their kernel anticheat on Windows 10 after it hits eol.
Windows 11 is much more convenient for identity tracking, so they’ll probably push for people to upgrade because Windows is too “insecure” for their games.
My CPU and motherboard are from 2016. I don’t mind updating harware to reach windows 11 compability, it’s about time anyway.
I would be angry if updating to 11 from 10 would also cost money directly.
For the most basic casual PC gamer SteamOS will be a game changer once they add more hardware support for it.
You mean Nvidia hardware. Nvidia purposefully sucks overall on Linux. Don’t reply with “mine works great” because you’re lying or haven’t had an issue yet. Fuck Nvidia.
This keeps getting brought up, but the reality is that there is nothing special about SteamOS 3. If people want a SteamOS-like OS (Immutable, Steam/Proton integrated, Steam Big Picture as Primary interface), then it already exists. Chimera, Bazzite, probably others. The only thing Valve could realistically improve on is the installation experience.
SteamOS’s only real advantage is that it is hardware restricted. Valve is able to test against a narrow field of hardware and insure a high degree of stability because of it.
Bazzite wants to say hello
So does Nobara.
Circle jerk intensifies
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I tried Linux Mint, and enjoyed my experience and even setup everything and then when I booted up Factorio Steam didn’t use my 3080 somehow. Pop OS worked but I didn’t like the experience. I’ll have to give Linux Mint a shot again.
That is almost certainly because Factorio has a native Linux version and Steam installed that instead of the Windows version. It was trying to use OpenGL and defaulting to CPU rendering because you likely haven’t altered the default configuration.
If you force Steam to use steam play, it will download the Windows version and run it through Proton which will use the right hardware.
I’ve not played Factorio but I’ve seen a vidjeo about it. How is the Windows version on Proton better than a Linux native version?
Wouldn’t the correct answer be to fix the graphics driver or configuration? And why doesn’t OpenGL just work? Or better yet, Vulkan?
It’s this nonsense that keeps people locked in to Windows.
Running the native version requires the user to configure their system correctly and then it would work. Most people who are coming to Linux from Windows are not interested in editing config files or using the terminal and, in any case, the vast majority of Linux gaming is done by running Windows games via WINE.
Proton is WINE packaged with the software and configuration scripts so that it ‘just works’ without user intervention. If you’re on Linux, you can install Steam and Go to Settings -> Compatibility and check ‘Allow Steam Play for all other titles’ and, from that point on, it will install the Windows version of the game and run it with Proton with no user interaction (other than clicking ‘Play’).
It’s this nonsense that keeps people locked in to Windows.
It isn’t nonsense, it makes perfect sense.
You can follow the error messages (which it prints to stdout when the game launches) and determine what the problem is so that you can fix it. The problem is completely understandable, the game logs would show exactly what device it was using and you could see what piece of software is responsible and go and look at the online documentation for that project to determine the exact configuration change that you need to make.
That’s how you should be troubleshooting problems, but you can’t do that on Windows because everything is a black box and provides little to no logs. If you’re lucky you’ll get an error message.
If you have a problem on Windows you first reboot and pray. Or, if that doesn’t fix it, you search random social media or forum posts, apply arbitrary registry changes recommended by Reddit comments, upgrade drivers, downgrade drivers, install motherboard firmware and dig through the various Windows GUI menus, which are change completely between Windows 8, 10 and 11 (but not 9, which doesn’t exist for some arbitrary reason), to locate a switch or checkbox that you can flip (and reboot again) until finally the problem resolves itself seemingly on its own. To me, this is the nonsense.
I’m confused. Shouldn’t me downloading the native Linux factorio and native Linux Steam be enough? Why would it default to something else?
