Is anyone actually surprised by this?
other ai services do too. u might not realize it.
Ok, so they’ll ban it under that guise to appease US companys, same as TikTok. I really didn’t care about TikTok since it’s all brain rot to me but this might actually be a tool I’ll use if it’s as efficient as they say.
Good thing I can run it locally, I guess.
Let the witch hunt begin.
No, this is just propaganda
Your devices keyboard app has been collecting all of your keystrokes.
Billions of folk’s keyboards are connected to the internet and the vast majority of them have no idea. It’s absolutely ludicrous that we’ve gotten to this stage with surveillance capitalism. Internet-connected keyboards are malware, plain and simple.
Sure, but its open source and doesn’t upload it anywhere. Also doesn’t have internet permission
Yeah whatever, everyone collects it now. Since it gets stored by a fascist state either way, who gives a fuck?
…and kids, that’s how Putin won the war against the concept of privacy, and Trump got indirect benefit out of it
yeah def not our own country going after privacy…
And you’re making it easy for them if you don’t give a fuck.
It’s amazing how Putin has become the Satan figure of the American Civil Religion, personally responsible for all evil in the world.
Er… no, he’s just responsible for all that evil he’s unabashedly doing right now. And is working very closely with the fascist party in our government. As a result, he’s become an important figure in the political landscape of the US.
Yes, and all evil is secretly him. Just like you say, secretly he’s working with everyone bad in the USA, and he’s secretly a very important figure in US politics. Just like he’s secretly behind me stubbing my toe.
… Is this a bit? Because thats some unhinged shit to believe if you’re being serious.
Just to be clear here, Putin isn’t responsible for all the worlds evils, that’s just… well, dumb. Sorry but like, who in their right mind could believe that? Seriously, I don’t know how you could possibly arrive at that conclusion.
And hell, he’s not even responsible for all the evils in the US. But he’s very openly and publicly working with the far right parties here, who are in their turn very open about working with him, and that makes him a very relevant current figure. Not… sure what part of that is a revelation.
Doubtful, since it’s both open source and you can run it locally. This seems more like a smear piece.
This article is about the app, which does not run the model locally. Why would you doubt that a Chinese app which openly claims they send your data to China, actually does so?
It seems like a smear piece because it makes it sound like DeepSeek is doing something that the others aren’t, while the truth is that ever single on of them collects your data.
At best, it’s disingenuous. At worst, with the ability to run locally, it’s a blatant lie.
What would you have preferred? “Most apps sell your data, news at 11”? Would anyone care if it was written like that?
Ah yes, selling your integrity for clicks and pushing propaganda for cash, welcome to the information age.
When you don’t understand how a web app works. 🤦
Does TikTok access my wifi network? 😤
This “China’s AI is taking your data and that’s bad” is shockingly similar to “TikTok is taking your data and that’s bad”. Lots of US counterparts do the same thing, but I don’t see (as much) media coverage about that.
Don Draper: “no no no, everyone else’s cigarettes are dangerous. Lucky Strikes are… toasted.”
The way I think of it is, I don’t live in China, so regardless of my objections to their values or human rights abuses, why would CCP or an affiliated company care about me or ruin my life on the basis of or by abusing my data? A big part of why I care about privacy is I don’t want to be filtering my every thought through consideration of whether the powers that be would approve, and US companies are way more relevant to that.
Sell to the highest bidder
These the excuses you start to make when you’re losing. Not looking great for the US…
Not surprised at all why would I? Don’t act like other AI services is privacy focused. It’s all same. THEY ALL COLLECT DATA.
But good thing about is deepseek is you can run locally unlike Closed AI Chat GPT. No need to use shitty app.
If I’m typing into the app, is that really collecting keystrokes?
And why is that an issue? It’s typing data sent to a language model. What nefarious info might they be looking for? Learning to imitate humans? Fingerprinting? Making the best virtual keyboard asmr?
If you’ve got nothing to hide you don’t have to worry ?
Beware! Anything you type into a Google search is sent to Google’s servers!
i mean…yes? that is generally how search platforms work.
I wouldn’t recommend anybody use any google based stuff directly (or at all, if possible) but if you do, then sending the search query is generally what would happen.
That’s the point. There is nothing strange or shady about the fact that things you type into DeepSeek.com are sent to DeepSeek.com. Obviously keystrokes you submit to a website are submitted to the website.
Oh yeah, the whole article could be reductively summed up as
“DeepSeek and all the other LLM services are almost as bad as each other, but we think deepseek is worse…because the Chinese government are known for doing bad things”.
The title is factual, if a little clickbaity.
Obviously keystrokes you submit to a website are submitted to the website.
This though, it’s not technically accurate, a lot of forms and input are done client side and then the resulting information is parceled up and sent to the server.
The actual keystroke data isn’t normally sent.
Though this article doesn’t go in to what kind of keystroke data is sent, if it was something more than just which keys in which order then that’s perhaps an indicator that it’s actively being collected for a reason, rather than just incidentally.
If you want to get really paranoid about such things it’s known that you can you can do interesting things with actual keystroke data.
Also, afaict none of the the non-chinese services have specified that they don’t do this.
Fair, but I don’t know what exactly I’d be hiding here
I shouldn’t have anything to hide, but I’m part of a group the current fascist leadership in government want’s to eradicate, so hide I shall.
That said, I also feel like people acting like the remote server they are connected to is tracking what you do on it as some kind of surprise is so stupid. “Facebook is keeping track of the pictures I uploaded to it!!!” There’s a lot of stuff to complain about Facebook, google, or whoever, but them tracking stuff you send to them willingly isn’t one of them.
At least its not stored on american servers.
I feel like Meta could do a ton more damage with my information than Tencent
No I’m not surprised at all. This is necessary for any kind of auto save and auto complete. Not happy about my shit being stored in China, but “collects every keystroke” isn’t really news anymore.
If you’re worried about this kind of behavior, don’t use any website with auto save or auto complete, period.
Assuming that DeepSeek really is logging keystrokes (they provided no evidence: who were they quoting?), that is unfortunately not uncommon. As shown by their TikTok pearl clutching, corporate media regularly goes for maximalist cold war fearmongering.
They are quoting DeepSeek’s privacy policy. They say this before and after the first quote, and also link the policy at the top of the article.
maybe they harvest passwords on the side?
It doesn’t have access to all your keystrokes. An app can only harvest the keystrokes typed into it.
Let’s be honest, ChatGPT is also logging keystrokes.
Yes. I also like how the alarming take on it is not “People are typing their passwords / medical histories / employer’s source code into ChatGPT and from there it goes straight into the training data not only to be stored forever in the corpus, but also sometimes, to be extracted at a later date by any yahoo who knows the way to tease it back out from ChatGPT via the right carefully crafted prompting!”
But instead it is “When you type things, they can see what you type! The keystrokes!”
And they probably aren’t even doing that. More likely, it’s just bot prevention.
I wouldn’t be so sure. China is at the world’s forefront of automated techniques to be able to spy on and manipulate people through their own devices at massive scale. If they had some semi-workable technology to fingerprint individuals through their typing patterns, in conjunction with fingerprinting the devices they were using through other means, that would make perfect sense to me.
I don’t think it is especially a concern for Deepseek specifically, for reasons discussed elsewhere in the comments. That one particular aspect of the privacy issue is probably being overblown, when there are other adjacent privacy and security concerns that are a lot more pressing. Honestly, that one particular detail isn’t really proven simply because it’s in the privacy policy, and even if they are doing something like that, its inclusion or not in this particular privacy policy or this app isn’t the particularly notable part about it.
they are actually training on this data (potentially). Its a fact. Only if you use some kind of special corporate license then they will not train on the data. (and you need to trust them on that)
(they provided no evidence: who were they quoting?)
https://platform.deepseek.com/downloads/DeepSeek Privacy Policy.html
Ctrl-F “rhythm”
I’ve noticed that this “there is no proof!” or “where’s the evidence?” all of a sudden has become popular. You have people saying it even when they’re talking about a very specific statement of a fact that’s very specifically and easily verifiable.
that is unfortunately not uncommon
Completely true. A lot of web sites monitor everything you do on them, and can play it back for anyone who’s curious about optimizing the UX or for any other less innocent reason. Generally I think there’s not much specific in their privacy policy about it when they do. It’s not surprising that this one is also doing that, accompanied by really a pretty minor line in their privacy policy to go along with it, I completely agree with you here.
As shown by their TikTok pearl clutching, corporate media regularly goes for maximalist cold war fearmongering.
Personally, I wish the corporate media would pearl-clutch a little bit more about how explicitly malicious to our interests our computing devices have become. “Everyone does it, so it’s not a big deal after all” is a common take to have, but it’s the exact opposite of the one that I personally have on it.
Everyone does it, so it’s not a big deal after all
…and I think that’s you completely misreading what people are saying.
We’re saying that it’s bunk for the corporate media to portray it as this dangerous thing when they refuse to report similarly on US companies doing the same with the same ferocity.
I think most people agree with you, that our privacy protections are fucking abysmal and no company should be being allowed to do this stuff. Hell, that’s like the entire thrust of Ed Zitron’s entire fucking blog: that none of these companies should get away with this.
It’s like when Facebook got fined a paltry sum for being caught lying about their video metrics and literally putting businesses like CollegeHumor out of business because they “pivoted to facebook video” to grab those high metrics… which never materialized because Facebook was ratfucking lying to people. They should have been shut down and put out of business for that, not fined less than they made ripping off people.
People are sick of the companies here getting a pass, and the media gives them a pass. It’s more that you can’t make freaked out headlines like this about TikTok and DeepSeek and not understand that everyone is rolling their fucking eyes because we’re all like “it’s no worse than what US companies already do to us.” That doesn’t mean we like it or are okay with it. It means we’re rolling our eyes are a fucking insipid news media that’s obviously lying to us for the sake of private American companies profit, not because they care about rightfully informing American citizentry about what is happening.
All of us fucking hate it, but what the fuck do you expect us as individuals to do about it? Folks like me have been voting Blue for 25 fucking years with fuck-all to show for it on issues like these. So why’s it our job to explain that we don’t support it, we just think it’s dumb as fuck when a foreign company is doing the same thing and now suddenly that’s evil, but our guys doing it is somehow fine. What we have issue with is the hypocrisy.
Dude, why is this guy getting so upset about the suggestion that people should be alarmed both by TikTok and also by the malicious behavior of all the other social media companies? And that the media should report more on it? Why is he yelling so much at me for making what I thought was that fairly reasonable suggestion?
Folks like me have been voting Blue for 25 fucking years
Oh. Um… what? What does that… okay.
I literally explained it pretty clearly.
At this point its clear you want to misunderstand.
Interesting that you took a few paragraphs with a handful of explitives thrown in as “yelling.”
https://platform.deepseek.com/downloads/DeepSeek Privacy Policy.html
Ctrl-F “rhythm”
I assumed that they couldn’t have gotten that from the privacy policy itself, because I’d never seen one be so explicit.
“Everyone does it, so it’s not a big deal after all” is a common take to have, but it’s the exact opposite of the one that I personally have on it.
That’s not my take, and I agree with you.
Well, you did say it was “pearl clutching” and “fearmongering.” My point is, they should be clutching pearls, and fear should be mongered. Arguably, at all the social media companies including TikTok.
I actually do agree that TikTok is worse, but it’s hardly the point. We can be alarmed about all of them, especially since the US ones are now in the hands of an overtly evil tyrannical government instead of merely the sociopathic profit-minded corporatocracy they were in before.
You’re literally talking to people in a privacy forum hosted outside of corporate social media… and you think people don’t agree with you. We wouldn’t fucking be here if we weren’t already on the same page about such issues.
That’s on you, dude.
I’m talking to someone in a privacy forum hosted outside of corporate social media who described reports about privacy violations committed by a privacy-invasive social media app as pearl-clutching and fearmongering.
I’m not sure what your deal is, here, but I’m not into it. I feel like what I said was pretty straightforward and you’re determined to gin up some kind of disagreement, where I’m supposed to say that corporate media’s reporting on privacy isn’t bad, or something.
Privacy good, corporate privacy invasion bad. Corporate media underreporting of privacy violations bad. Hopefully that makes sense, and we can agree on it. I’m not into whatever argument you’re attempting to create about it.
Privacy good, corporate privacy invasion bad. Corporate media underreporting of privacy violations bad.
We never had an argument other than you keep positing that people don’t agree with this while they’re busy explaining to you that yes, they actually do, and you keep choosing to ignore that. “Corporate media underreporting of privacy violations bad” is literally what I spent several paragraphs explaining that you took as “yelling” and “disagreement.”
…but keep on arguing with people who actually agree with you and telling yourself they don’t.
or maybe just learn to fucking read.
Got it. Yeah, fair enough. What I was aiming to do, more or less, was ask for clarification, but I definitely see how it could come across as me trying to continue the argument when he was saying that he already agreed with me. I think you hopping into it with a big italic and bold wall of text on the thing that apparently all three of us already agree on only confused the issue further.
Anyway, sounds like we’re all on the same page. Cool.
Oh yeah and ChatGPT doesn’t
