• ☂️-
    0•1 year ago

    mfs with a 16 core cpu, 64gb ram and 10tb storage be like

    • Ziixe
      0•1 year ago

      This, MFers will have the most top spec computer and worry about bloat while I install random shit for fun on my 320gb had drive that’s also my boot drive on my core 2 duo computer with 3 gigs of ram that struggles to run firefox and thunar at the same time (also cinnamon is the best running on my computer from my testing, xfce is laggy af and I’m not even going to mention kde, bspwm or any other since the, either lag beyond usability (KDE) or just straight up crash my computer into tty when i try to launch them (bspwm), one massive note is that I’m using software rendering since the GPU on the core 2 duo is struggling with even drawing the boot screen)

      Literally have probably a ton of overlap software from installing the desktop environments and other random (well not very random, stuff I used on windows before) software that I don’t bother googling the deleting commands since apt installed them all as snaps because I never noticed in my first three months of use, fuck you Ubuntu, Xubuntu and all other derivatives, this shit makes me not want to use Ubuntu ever again (not like i can, my pc is fucked and no other drive is bootable, i can’t even boot an install usb)

      • @DickFiasco@lemm.ee
        0•1 year ago

        You might want to check out the i3 tiling window manager. Shit’s under 50MB and makes every other DE I’ve ever used feel bloated and laggy.

        • Ziixe
          0•1 year ago

          Yeah, I’m not actually not very into the tiling window manager thing, I tried bspwm just for the sake of wanting to try one but I since lost interest, I’ll keep it in mind though and maybe come back and try it one day

    • Lemmy
      0•1 year ago

      Is there a way to download Debian with GNOME without all the bloat?

      • @Username@feddit.de
        0•1 year ago

        You don’t use GNOME to get rid of bloat. You use it to get a fully functional opinionated desktop without tweaking too much.

        If you want no “bloat”, whatever that is, use some minimal compositor like Sway or something.

        Personally, I say: Give me all the bloat, I love it! I love every cool and quality of life feature there is. I have enough space on any desktop computer.

        • Lemmy
          0•1 year ago

          Yes, I understand that, but I don’t need all the games and stuff installed by default. Sway is a whole different experience. I use i3 on my older laptop (Macbook A1181 w/ Libreboot) but I personally wouldn’t want to use it unless I needed to.

          GNOME is a gorgeous desktop environment, I just hate the fact that I have to take a additional 5-10 minutes every install just removing all the stuff I don’t need. Is there a debloater script for GNOME that you know of?

  • @Zozano@lemy.lol
    0•1 year ago

    Most people in this thread don’t get it.

    You know how some people compete to see who can get doom to run on the craziest platforms, like a calculator?

    It’s like that. There’s something oddly satisfying about stripping everything back to the most basic level - to make things work for you within the most constrictive environment you enforce for yourself.

    It’s like eating a spicy shellfish dinner and super gluing your asshole closed.

    • @OsrsNeedsF2P@lemmy.ml
      0•1 year ago

      Step 1. Install the most secure, pure, minimalist Linux distro

      Step 2. Get frustrated at the complications

      Step 3. Give up and go back to Windows

      • a story I’ve seen happen more than once
      • @pizzazz@lemmy.world
        0•1 year ago

        For me unfortunately it has been Step 1 install literally the most universally compatible distro possible

        Step 2 audio drivers craps out. No fix is available. Trying to apply workarounds completely Bork the system

        Step 3 install again. graphics driver is problematic, refresh it giving it MOS permissions. I miss the MOS permission screen at the reboot. Look for how to do obtain that option again. No easy way to do it at all. Bork the system again

        Step 4 install again. Notice touch screen support is completely useless, and pen is not supported.

        Step 5 Ask myself if keeping a 1200$ computer with tinny audio, no graphic hardware acceleration and a half functional display can be justified in any way. It can’t.

        Step 5. Back to windows. Bloated, but it works.

        Unfortunately system support is still very iffy on some models. I’d really like to embrace the distro life but can’t.

        • @woelkchen@lemmy.world
          0•1 year ago

          Without claiming that I would be able to fix any problems, I’m curious which hardware that is. In all honesty I can’t remember the actual audio driver ever crapping out in the last 15 or so years. I find this fascinating and like to know more.

          The set of hardware I’ve had most problems with had been various types of WiFi adapters from Realtek and Broadcom.

      • @Allero@lemmy.today
        0•1 year ago

        Step 1. Install user-friendly Linux distro

        Step 2. Get frustrated at the complications

        Step 3. Try to check back on Windows

        Step 4. Get completely disgusted, realize just HOW much bloated and slow and terrible Windows is

        Step 5. Learn Linux-fu and live happy ever after

        That’s my path

      • CubitOomEnglish
        0•1 year ago

        I’ve had the exact opposite experience on arch, mostly because of the arch wiki.

        1. Install arch using the arch wiki for reference
        2. If an issue arises, consult the arch wiki
        3. Document, contribute, and help others
      • @mrmanager@lemmy.today
        0•1 year ago

        Go back to windows is not an option, it’s a really horrible system. I dont see how people can use it without blowing their brains out.

        • @sum_yung_gai@lemm.ee
          0•1 year ago

          It just works. I don’t want to have to invest time in making my os work. I want to spend my time on my projects(which I use wsl for)

          I totally understand the desire and satisfaction of having complete control over your os but a lot of people just want to be able to do simple stuff like game and browse the web which windows does just fine in my experience.

          • @Allero@lemmy.today
            0•1 year ago

            I’d argue Linux falls short on audience that needs a little more than browsing and simple games, but are themselves a little less than sysadmins. That’s the audience that is really hurt by the transition. The rest (simple as well as power users) should be just fine.

            Even still, with Windows being the mainstream option, it just goes as a no-brainer and a default solution for the majority of people, regardless of how good or bad it is.

      • @psycho_driver@lemmy.world
        0•1 year ago

        Oh I’m sure. People get used to something because it’s forced on them and change is hard. Also, ADD is at all time highs thanks to portable devices.

        People who are abducted and held captive often experience Stockholm Syndrome once they find themselves set free.

      • @woelkchen@lemmy.world
        0•1 year ago

        I’ve seen “Step 3: Buy a Mac” plenty of times for exactly that audience. They like tinkering as a college student and when they enter the working world they realize that tinkering all the time impedes their financial bottom line. Then they go from Linux fans to hardcore Linux haters (“it’s for playing around, not serious work”), even though a convenience distro like Fedora would have solved all their problems in an instant.

    • @Pantherina@feddit.de
      0•1 year ago

      Neofetch is unmaintained btw, fastfetch is a good replacement… for whoever needs that. I wrote my own tool for getting system info and I like my terminals to have free space

      • @cybersandwich@lemmy.world
        0•1 year ago

        Is it unmaintained completely or just feature complete and not getting recent updates?

        I’ve seen people say “this tool isn’t being maintained because there aren’t recent check ins” and those two things are very different.

        • @Pantherina@feddit.de
          0•1 year ago

          It is written in Bash which I guess makes it pretty high level and stable. Until it breaks it shouldnt need much work.

          Bash is damn slow though, so fastfetch (mainly in C) is way better for the “arch flex”

      • 56!
        0•1 year ago

        oh no! not unmaintained! The unmaintenance gremlins are going to implement so many bugs and vulnerabilities!

  • massive_bereavement
    0•1 year ago

    Flatpaks have helped me a lot reducing bloat, avoiding dependency hell.

    That said, probably there’s some overlapping dependencies that, if installed in a different way I could save some space, but it’s not worth it in my opinion.

    I’m also using rootless podman+systemd for certain services, but that’s been a mixed bag compared with plain old docker or LXC.

    • @Samueru@lemmy.world
      0•1 year ago

      Flatpak is like the most bloated thing ever because of the runtime and all the dependencies it needs.

      I did a test, flatpak with just firefox installed used 3 GiB of space.

      While 15 appimages that includes heavy applications like libreoffice, kdenlive and two web browsers uses 1.2GiB.

    • @TrickDacy@lemmy.world
      0•1 year ago

      I thought the number one drawback to flatpaks is that they’re enormous because each one includes all its own dependencies

  • @jroid8@lemmy.world
    0•1 year ago

    You can use window managers instead of DEs. While I prefer DEs because how much features they have you may not need these features

      • Lunya \ she/it
        0•1 year ago

        smh get real, install Hyprland and 50 utilities for it (30 of those are sway utilities)

        • @reinei@lemmy.world
          0•1 year ago

          But at least you don’t need to use a stupidly long argument to start it (I know both don’t really have support but sway runs it in your face even more than normal) because you can’t quite be as choosy with laptops as you can be with desktops…

      • Turun
        0•1 year ago

        This is the way.

        Install tiling wm, because I can’t without anymore. Install a DE, because I actually like the discoverability of graphical settings programs.

    • @lemmyingly@lemm.ee
      0•1 year ago

      It seems to be seen across all platforms.

      What I find interesting is that no one is asking about the quality of code, nor do they seem concerned about the dependencies but they do care about that one package/app/program of any size they see and don’t immediately know why it’s there.

    • Great Blue Heron
      0•1 year ago

      For me it’s not about the size, it’s about the understanding. I’d really like to understand what everything on my system does and why it’s there. It seems impossible with modern systems. Back in the '90s I needed a secure email relay - it had lilo, kernel, init, getty, bash, vi, a few shell utils (before busybox…), syslogd and sendmail. I’m not sure any more as it was a long time ago, but I think I even statically linked everything so there was no libc. I liked that system.

    • SeekPie
      0•1 year ago

      So you have a folder and need to find a specific file from it. Would it be faster to find the file when there are 5 folders or 500?

    • @cevn@lemmy.world
      0•1 year ago

      For me it was a problem with update frequency and how long they would take. Once i got rid of my flatpaks and moved to stable firefox i update once a week instead of daily now and it takes seconds instead of minutes. Probably also solvable with auto updates.

      • @cybersandwich@lemmy.world
        0•1 year ago

        You realize you don’t have to backup the actual “bloated” programs. Just maybe their configs and any files those programs generate that you’d like to keep, right?

        • @NaoPb@eviltoast.orgEnglish
          0•1 year ago

          I remember what my idea of making backups was when I was a wee grasshopper.

          Making a backup of the whole OS instead of just the configs and user files.

          I have come a long way since then.

        • DefederateLemmyMlEnglish
          0•1 year ago

          That’s committing the cardinal sin of cherrypicking your backup contents. You may end up forgetting to include things that you didn’t know you needed until restore time and you’re creating a backup that is cumbersome to restore. Always remember: you should really be creating a restore strategy rather than a backup strategy.

          As a general rule I always backup the filesystem wholesale, optionally exclude things of which I’m 100% sure that I don’t need it, and keep multiple copies (daylies and monthlies going some time back) so I always have a complete reference of what my system looked like at a particular point in time, and if push comes to shove I can always revert to a previous state by wiping the filesystem and copying one of the backups to it.

    • @jack@monero.town
      0•1 year ago

      It’s not about storage. It’s about complexity getting back at you, for example not knowing what caused a problem because multiple programs are stepping on each others feet

    • nitrolife
      0•1 year ago

      or you can’t buy if you’re not successful enough or you’re in the wrong country. For example, in my country, the minimum cost of a 1TB SSD is about $85 and a salary of $2,000 is considered a very successful salary at the upper limit

  • @octopus_ink@lemmy.mlEnglish
    0•1 year ago

    I mean - you control what gets installed on Arch. One finger pointing at arch is three pointing back in this scenario…

    • @fossphi@lemm.eeEnglish
      0•1 year ago

      You also control what’s being installed on other distros. In fact, other distros split their packages in a way more modular way which allows one to pick and choose what one needs granularly. In Arch, the package count is lower because the maintainers don’t split stuff up. But you get all the so called bloat when you installna regular package

    • Joe Cool
      0•1 year ago

      And you’d have to try pretty hard to make it as infested with snaps.

  • cally [he/they]English
    0•1 year ago
    > Install NixOS
> Learn about Nix
> Organise your dotfiles
> Learn about flakes
> Organise your dotfiles
> Learn about modularisation
> Organise your dotfiles
> ...
    • @woelkchen@lemmy.world
      0•1 year ago

      It is bloat if dependencies aren’t defined properly and the packager defines a too broad set of dependencies.

      (Disclaimer: I don’t use Arch myself but I am a packager of a small “scratch my own itch” but public repository for another distribution.)

  • @Telodzrum@lemmy.world
    0•1 year ago

    Every person who comments about “bloat” in their install should be required to preface their post or comment with a full definition of “bloat.”

    This shit is obnoxious.